>> WELCOME TO METRO FOCUS.

THE OPERA IS ONE OF THE MOST ELEGANT FORMS OF ENTERTAINMENT TO COME OUT OF THE WESTERN CLASSICAL TRADITION.

IT IS NOT RACIALLY INCLUSIVE.

OPERAS HAVE RARELY FEATURED BLACK CHARACTERS AND WHEN THEY HAVE, THEY HAVE TENDED TO BE BASED ON RACIST STEREOTYPES PERFORMED BY WHITE ACTORS IN BLACKFACE.

WQXR IS EXPLORING THE REPRESENTATION AND HIGHLIGHTING THE OVERLOOKED CONTRIBUTION OF MUSIC.

EVERY VOICE WITH TERRANCE McKNIGHT IS AVAILABLE EVERYWHERE YOU FIND YOUR FAVORITE PODCASTS.

JOINING US NOW ON THE INTERSECTION BETWEEN BLACKNESS AND OPERA.

HE IS THE HOST OF EVERY VOICE WITH TERRANCE McKNIGHT.

TERRANCE, WELCOME TO METROFOCUS.

>> THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR HAVING ME.

>> FOR THE FIVE PEOPLE IN NEW YORK WHO DO NOT KNOW YOU, GIVE US A LITTLE BACKGROUND ON HOW YOU BECAME SUCH A FAN AND A STUDENT OF THIS FORM OF CLASSICAL MUSIC.

>> I WENT TO COLLEGE FOR MUSIC.

IN MOST PLACES IN OUR COUNTRY, IF YOU GO TO STUDY MUSIC IN COLLEGE, YOU STUDY WESTERN AND EUROPEAN MUSIC.

OFTEN TIMES, YOU BEGIN WITH MUSIC FROM THE RENAISSANCE, THERE IS A PARTICULAR FOCUS ON THE BAROQUE PERIOD .

THAT IS HOW I WAS INTRODUCED TO OPERA AS A YOUNG PERSON AND I STARTED LOOKING AT IT AND THINKING ABOUT IT SERIOUSLY.

>> OKAY.

THAT IS IMPORTANT TO POINT OUT.

THIS DID HAPPEN AT A HISTORICAL AND BLACK UNIVERSITY.

I THINK THAT FOR A LOT OF PEOPLE, THE IDEA OF CLASSICAL MUSIC, WHICH DOES COME OUT OF THE EUROPEAN TRADITION WOULD SEEM TO NOT INCLUDE BLACK PEOPLE, BLACK CHARACTERS, BLACK VOICES, ET CETERA.

WHAT IS YOUR PODCAST ILLUMINATING THAT THEY MIGHT HAVE MISSED OR NOT FULLY UNDERSTOOD?

>> THE THING IS THAT OPERA IS AND WAS ENTERTAINMENT.

THERE WERE NOT MANY OPTIONS FOR ENTERTAINMENT BACK IN THE 1600S.

FOLKS THAT WERE OF A CERTAIN CLASS, WHO HAD MONEY, POWER, INFLUENCE , THAT WAS THE FORM OF ENTERTAINMENT.

SHOWING HOW MUCH MONEY YOU HAD AND HOW MUCH POWER YOU HAD ANY RATTLE MUSICIANS WORKING FOR YOU.

THEY WROTE MUSIC TO ENTERTAIN YOU.

A LOT OF THESE FOLKS THAT COULD AFFORD OPERA COULD AFFORD TO HAVE A PERFORMED AND THEY WERE INVESTED IN THE SLAVE TRADE.

I FIGURED THAT THIS IS ENTERTAINMENT FORM AND THE MESSAGES COMING THROUGH THIS ENTERTAINMENT FORM HAD TO ADDRESS SOME OF THE SOCIAL AND POLITICAL AND INDUSTRIAL THINGS THAT WERE HAPPENING.

THE MUSIC SUPPORTED THEIR PHILOSOPHY AND IDEOLOGY ABOUT WHO THEY WERE AND TO THE FOLKS THAT WERE BEING CAPTURED WERE.

>> CAN YOU GIVE US AN EXAMPLE OF SOME OF THE THEMES YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT HOW BLACK CHARACTERS WERE PRO-TRADE FOR THE AUDIENCE THAT WAS INVESTED IN THE TRANS-ATLANTIC SLAVE TRADE?

>> THE FIRST ONE THAT WE DEAL WITH IS MOZART'S MAGIC FLUTE.

THE IN THE SECOND PART OF THE SERIES, WE COME BACK TO O TELLO, IT WAS WRITTEN BY SHAKESPEARE IN 1590 OR SO.

HE WORKS FOR QUEEN ELIZABETH AND ELIZABETH I AND QUEEN AN AND KING JAMES WHO TRANSLATED THE BIBLE INTO ENGLISH.

SHAKESPEARE WROTE FOR THESE FOLKS.

MOZART WROTE IN THE LATE 1790S.

THAT IS THE MAGIC FLUTE.

YOU HAVE THIS CHARACTER CALLED --AND HE IS DETECTED AS A -- GUARDING A PRINCESS, WIDE AND BEAUTIFUL AND THINGS THAT I AM BLACK, BLACK IS UGLY, WHITE IS BEAUTIFUL, I AM SMITTEN AND CAPTIVATED BY HER BEAUTY.

THERE IS A SCENE WHERE HE IS DOING HIS JOB AND SHE IS TRYING TO ESCAPE ANY CAPTURES HER, AND SAYS, I DID A GREAT JOB, HIS BOSS, DID A GREAT JOB.

I WILL REWARD YOU.

AND HE SAYS, I DO NOT DESERVE A REWARD.

HE SAYS, I WILL GIVE YOU 77 LASHES ACROSS YOUR FEET.

JUST BECAUSE HE COULD, TO SHOW HIS SUPERIORITY AND THIS IS THE LAUGH TRACK FOR THE STORY.

HE IS THE BUFFOON.

AND THAT BECOMES PART OF WHAT MAKES IT COMEDIC , HIS MINISTRY MAN HIS DESIRE FOR FAMILY AND LOVE AND THAT BECOMES THE LAUGH TRACK.

HIS INABILITY TO NOT BE CAPTURED AND CAPTIVATED BY THE SOUND OF MUSIC, NO MATTER WHAT HE IS DOING, IT MAKES THEM DANCE AND THAT BECOMES THE LAUGH TRACK AND SOME OF THE STEREOTYPES AND TROPES THAT WE SEE IN AMERICA THAT ARE PART OF OUR CULTURE NOW, WE BE SET UP IN OPERA IN 1791 AND IT SUPPORTS SYSTEM TO BLACKNESS BACK THEN.

>> HOW DO YOU INCORPORATE POSITIVE INSTANCES OF BLACK ARTISTS BEING INVOLVED IN OPERA WHEN A STORY LIKE THAT OR A THEME LIKE THAT IS SO PROFOUND?

>> I AM AMERICAN.

WE ARE AMERICANS.

WE LIKE UNDERDOGS.

WE LIKE TO SEE THE PERSON FROM THE BOTTOM COME TO THE TOP AND IN A CASE LIKE THIS WHERE THIS GUY IS CAST AT THE LOWEST RUNG OF SOCIETY.

IF WE AS AUDIENCE MEMBERS AND DIRECTORS AND CONDUCTORS CAN EMPATHIZE WITH WHAT THIS MAN WANTS, HIS DESIRE FOR COMMUNITY AND HIS DESIRE FOR AFFECTION , IF WE CAN BRING THAT TO THE FRONT OF OUR INTERPRETATION AND HOW THIS FITS INTO THE STORY, THERE CAN BE A SHIFT.

IF WE CAN SEE THAT ANEMIA MAYBE WE CAN HAVE MORE EMPATHY FOR THE MAN SITTING ON THE BENCH AT HOME.

IN THIS PODCAST I AM TALKING ABOUT, WE BRING THE PAST AND THE PRESENT INTO THE STREETS WHERE WE HAVE TO WORK AND LOVE TOGETHER.

IF WE CANNOT LAUGH AT HIM BECAUSE OF HIS DESIRE TO BE PART OF A COMMUNITY IT CAN TRANSLATE TO HOW WE CAN TREAT ONE ANOTHER.

>> IS A FORM OF ENTERTAINMENT.

YOUNGER BLACK LISTENERS MIGHT WANT TO KNOW, WHY ARE WE FORCING A SPACE WHERE PEOPLE WILL LOOK LIKE ME WHERE YOU HAVE BEEN ROUTINELY DISRESPECTED FOR GENERATIONS, WHY IS THAT OF VALUE?

>> WE HEAR A LOT ABOUT CANCELING HISTORY, CANCELING BOOKS, CANCELING STORIES, THINGS ARE OFFENSIVE.

WHEN IN OPERA HAS BEEN AROUND FOR 200 YEARS, IT WILL BE CONTINUING TO PERFORM.

AND IT WILL TRY TO OTHER THIS CHARACTER.

I THINK THERE IS A TEACHING MOMENT HERE.

I THINK THERE IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR US TO LOOK AT THAT CHARACTER AND NOT ONLY TO SEE OURSELVES AND REALLY USE IT , AS I SAID, AS A TEACHING MOMENT.

FOR ME, USING MOZART TO BRING OUT ASPECTS OF BLACK HISTORY AND HUMAN HISTORY IS AN OPPORTUNITY.

THERE ARE CANCELLATIONS OF CERTAIN STORIES AND CERTAIN HISTORY.

I'M NOT SURE THAT FOLKS WILL CANCEL MOZART.

I'M GOING TO FIND A WAY TO BRING A BROADER PERSPECTIVE AND BRING MY OWN PERSONAL HISTORY INTO THAT STORY TO INSPIRE SOMEONE ELSE.

>> OF COURSE.

I WANT TO GO BACK TO THE TITLE OF THE PODCAST.

IT IS EVERY VOICE, WHY DID YOU TITLE THE PODCAST EVERY VOICE?

>> I GREW UP IN CHURCH.

MY MOTHER USED TO TELL ME THAT YOU NEVER KNOW WHAT WAS GOING TO WALK IN THAT DOOR ON SUNDAY MORNING.

TO FIND A WAY THROUGH YOUR MUSIC OF MINISTERING TO EVERYONE NO MATTER IF YOU KNOW THEM OR NOT, YOU NEED TO USE YOUR MUSIC TO HELP SOMEBODY AND YOU NEVER KNOW WHAT SOMEONE IS GOING THROUGH WHEN THEY WALK THROUGH THIS DOOR.

WITH MY OPPORTUNITY FOR RADIO, THAT IS SORT OF MY FOCUS.

IT IS EVERYONE.

IT IS ALL OF US.

>> WE ARE ALMOST OUT OF TIME.

I WANT YOU TO HIGHLIGHT THE KIND OF WORK THAT YOU SHOW.

IT WAS TITLED LANGSTON AND BEETHOVEN, BLACK AND PROUD.

>> WHEN I READ HIS POETRY , THEY HAD SO MANY THINGS IN COMMON.

THEY REALLY LIKED COMMON PEOPLE AND WORKING-CLASS FOLKS.

HE WOULD TRY TO UNDERSTAND THE WORKING CLASS PEOPLE AND IDENTIFY WITH THEM AND WRITE ABOUT THEM.

HE WAS VERY SIMILAR, THERE WERE CASES WHERE PEOPLE TRY TO CALL BEETHOVEN --HE LIKES TO LISTEN TO FOLK MUSICIANS AND IF I CAN BRING THESE TWO GUYS TOGETHER AND WITH A FORCED INTEGRATION OF CULTURE ACROSS TWO DIFFERENT CENTURIES THAT THEY BOTH HAVE THIS ABILITY TO SPEAK DIRECTLY FROM THEIR HEART TO THE HEARTS OF THE LISTENERS.

BEETHOVEN'S MUSIC AND LANGSTON'S POETRY TOGETHER THE WAY THAT I WAS HOPING TO BRING TWO DIFFERENT AUDIENCES TOGETHER.

GOES BACK TO GROWING UP IN THINKING OF WAYS TO MINISTER AND CONVERT AS MANY PEOPLE.

>> THAT IS THE NOTE WE WILL HAVE TO LEAVE IT ON.

TERRENCE, I WANT TO THANK YOU FOR JOINING US.

IT IS CALLED EVERY VOICE WITH TERRANCE McKNIGHT AND THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THE PODCAST AND THE WORK THAT YOU ARE DOING.

THANK YOU SO MUCH.

>> THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.